In general, if you have to use violence to defend yourself, you may have to justify that in court. If you use potentially or actually lethal force, the chances of having to justify it in court go up exponentially.
One of your primary defenses will be how you were trained, what you learned during your education process, and how your defensive mindset was formed. As part of that, it helps to document your training through class notes (taking them yourself if necessary), video clips of the instructor (often found on YouTube), recordings, etc. You can also introduce as evidence material from others that reinforces and supports your defensive mindset.
I'd like to show you one such piece of material this morning, particularly because Antifa, the progressive far-left-wing movement behind much of the anti-Trump and anti-conservative unrest of recent months, was advertising credit-card-sized concealed knives on its Web site. These things may be tiny, relatively speaking, but they can do an awful lot of damage - potentially disabling damage, if not inflicting permanent injury such as the loss of an eye or a severed nerve - in the hands of someone who knows how to use one. The odds are increasing that people like us may run into one of these demonstrations - so it behooves us to be prepared to counter such violence, in defense of ourselves and our loved ones.
Here's what even a very small knife can do to a human being. I recommend watching the video in full-screen mode.
Remember that video. Bookmark it and/or save a copy for future reference. Remember Antifa's attempts to sell knives of similar size to its members, and their open discussion about the need to arm and train themselves. Remember it if you run into them while about your lawful business . . . and keep them out of knife range, by whatever means may be necessary (and, of course, legal - that goes without saying). If you ever have to justify that decision and/or your actions, play back that video in court, point out Antifa's discussions and its efforts to sell knives to its members, and make it clear that you considered yourself in imminent danger of suffering similar injuries unless you stopped them. It's a compelling argument.
Peter
Also google Tueller Drill.
ReplyDeleteProving you have knowledge of this is one leg of your mindset defense, should you ever need it. It's one thing to say you were in reasonable fear for your life or grave injury, it's another to be able to back up that "reasonable" with knowledge of the potential for damage and knowledge of the reaction gap.
Mail or similar anti stab protection is going to be a must if people are attending these events.
ReplyDeleteI do expect to see basically shanking attacks Folsom style
Also note, this isn't an escalation, the Traditionalists Workers Party and some other actual Neo Nazis group was attacked with knives up in Sacramento during a legal protest but being who they are, allegedly removed the enemies knives and hospitalized a number of them
Frankly what groups like The Shieldwall Network , Violent Solutions and others have been doing, doxxing and unmasking potentially violent AntiFa is the most important thing right now anyway, Forcing them into then open keeps the violence down
Peter,
ReplyDeleteI will again take issue with your basic premise: "The odds are increasing that people like us may run into one of these demonstrations"
"People like us" should be smarter than that. The prudent see danger and get outa Dodge..
If you have not by now seen that cities have been weighed and found wanting, you ain't been paying attention. These people only inhabit areas with formalized social welfare infrastructure. They cannot survive any other way.
Always move away from crowds, either impromptu or in every day living.
"People like us" should be smarter than that. The prudent see danger and get outa Dodge..
ReplyDeleteSometimes, the trouble comes to you. Can you say for sure that the commies won't target your place of business, your church, your kids' school?
@Anonymous at 4:49 PM: That's all very well for those of us who can afford to move away from cities (Miss D. and I have already done so). However, many of those who read this blog aren't in a position to do the same; and the rest of us can't help but go to or travel through cities from time to time. Distance from trouble is no guarantee that we won't run into it anyway - or that it won't run into us.
ReplyDeletenonnymouse@4:49
ReplyDelete""People like us" should be smarter than that. The prudent see danger and get outa Dodge.."
Your binary thinking (safe/unsafe) has little usefulness in the real world. This sort of trouble cannot be totally avoided by the VAST majority of real people anywhere in the world.
Yes, some small number of people are able to significantly lessen their possible exposure to group attacks, but to expect 100% avoidance, even for them, is unrealistic. Flashmobs alone makes this impossible. Those come to you, and can't be avoided ahead of time. That's just one potential problem.
The advice "don't be there" was giving originally in a specific context wrt places you KNOW are dangerous.
ReplyDeleteIt's completely useless to say to people 'never go where there are other people.' Trouble found victims in the baggage claim area of the Ft Lauderdale Airport. Would that have been on your 'no go' list? Trouble found this guy while pumping gas in broad daylight. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4494274/Man-kills-gunman-shootout-Illinois-gas-station.html
Antifa and groups like it will adopt the tactics of other effective organizations, and ISIS attacks with knives have been effective. They specifically offered the 'credit card' knives as offensive weapons. So far they've limited themselves to attacks from a crowd, and hidden in anonymous groups. That won't last either.
You can choose to minimize your exposure to KNOWN risks. You cannot eliminate exposure to risks, and glib admonitions to 'just don't be there' aren't helpful.
BTW, the knife guy in the video is one of the presenters on The Best Defense, a show on the Outdoor Life Network. I recommend it. Every episode they look at several potential responses to real world defensive situations. I guarantee you will learn something from it.
nick
Also, the idea of a protective layer is in fact already a thing and is actively marketed to the public in the UK:
ReplyDelete"PPSS slash and cut resistant clothing is worn by both the general public and those in professional occupations to combat the ever increasing rise of violent knife crime in the UK.
London alone already sees up to 1000 knife attacks a month.
Although the risk of injury through knife crime is statistically low, it is still a risk. Until recently, the public could do little to protect themselves from a bladed attack or assault."
google slashpro protective clothing for suppliers
or Cut-tex pro
nick
Here in Australia, if you are carrying ANYTHING that can be viewed as an 'offensive weapon', be it a knitting needle, even a walking cane, you are in a world of trouble if you are involved in an altercation.
ReplyDeleteNot the bad guys though, they'll more often than not get a slap on the wrist and be let go to continue what they do. It's not the Police who are the problem here, it is our broken justice system, particularly the Judges, by dint of the ludicrous penalties they hand down, they are the enablers.
When I worked in law enforcement many years ago, we received a lot of training on being attacked by someone with a knife. The "21 foot rule" (7 yards) was given as the distance a suspect could cover and reach you to stab or slash before you could draw your handgun and pull the trigger.
ReplyDeleteWe were taught to never allow anyone holding a knife (or similar sharp object) that close or any closer without already having drawn and aimed at the suspect. Obviously, it isn't a hard and fast distance, as you could be separated by vehicles, a low wall, or other things you can place between you and a knife wielding person. Besides, if they are moving, you should be moving, too.
But I was shown the video "Surviving Edged Weapons" at three different agencies where that 21 feet was given as an absolute minimum, so I can state with complete honesty that _that_ was how I was trained, including with practice on the mat, with simulated weapons. Even with lots of practice drawing from our holsters (some of us, anyway), it was easy for someone to stab or slice you before you could get a shot off.
Simply _seeing_ a knife is no excuse to shoot (yes, I know a number of cops have been deemed justified for doing just that), but if the suspect is close, you should be holding your weapon and opening the distance between you even if the suspect Isn't moving. If he/she is moving toward you, you should be shooting while moving.
If you can't find a range where you can practice shooting while moving, try to find a rural area where you can do so. DON'T stand still, even if all you can manage is to shuffle a few steps to one side or the other, or moving at an angle. You can even move, stop momentarily to shoot, then _immediately_ move again, if that is the best you can do and still hit your target (a technique that works for some novice shooters).
At a private range we did an interesting version of the Tueler drill. They had a sled that holds a target tied to a rope. Measure off 21 feet an the shooter stands there. Then without warning some runs with the sled. Shooter draws when the target moves. I am drawing 1.5-1.6 and got 6 shots off. All decent center of mass hits. Would that stop someone in time idk but it would probably hurt them for the hands fight.
ReplyDeleteThe hard thing is baring cops dealing with knife wielding druggies/ mental patients it won't happen that way. The guy will approach you asking for the time or to bum a dollar/ smoke an the knife will come out at 1-5 feet.
"People like us" should be smarter than that. The prudent see danger and get outa Dodge..
ReplyDelete"Dodge" has this habit of moving around......
One could be several blocks away from an Antifa demonstration and encounter small groups, or indivduals, either headed for the event or "roaming."
The smiling young man who - unknown to you - is Antifa, or a "fellow traveler" interested in creating as much mayhem as possible - walking toward you on the sidewalk, has a 1.5-2" blade concealed in his hand, and while you're yakking on your phone he takes a step toward you and quickly slashes once.
Your life just changed. Forever. Good thing that was a really important phone call you were on. I'd hate to give up the use of one arm for the rest of my life just because I was ordering pizza.
Tueller Drill: The 21 foot distance has been enshrined in folklore, and that is what Dennis Tueller originally came up with. Recent research indicates the "safe distance" is actually closer to 33 feet. You may be able to do a 5-yard Bill Drill in 1.5 seconds (from start signal, draw and fire 6 rounds, all into the A ring of an IPSC target) but even at 33 feet there's an excellent chance that those 6 rounds will not have sufficient effect to prevent simple momentum on the part of the attacker allowing him to plant the knife in your chest. If the caliber you're carrying is >1.00", maybe it'll work. I doubt your compact 9MM will, though, and why are you still carrying that 380? Oh, right - it fits your pocket and is light. OK, then.
Untrained knife attackers stab. Trained knife attackers (or defenders) slash. There are a lot of advanced self defense courses that stress slashing the inside of arms precisely because it destroys the ability to grasp, just as the video shows. If your attacker cannot grasp you he cannot control you, and he must control you to succeed in the attack. And since arms are extended to attack, the forearm is an easy target.
One slash - interior forearm or upper arm area (where the brachial artery is) can be executed in under two seconds, and with training, not much over one second. Slash and keep walking, unless someone is watching him do it he'll get away with it. Bleedout to unconsciousness from severing the brachial artery is under 120 seconds. If the knife is very sharp you won't feel the cut, and you'll spend the first 45 seconds not knowing you're cut.
BTW, when that phone's clamped to your ear, where's your upper arm? And that tourniquet you carry in your car, "just in case"?
The Marines have a saying: Be polite, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet. But you first must be aware of the people you encounter.
Never mind all that, though, because I want all of you to keep talking on your phones while you're walking around; it makes you more attractive targets than me.