It seems Paypal, after inserting both feet firmly into its corporate mouth, is trying to backtrack and do damage control.
“An [Accepted Use Policy] notice recently went out in error that included incorrect information,” a PayPal spokesperson said. “PayPal is not fining people for misinformation and this language was never intended to be inserted in our policy. We’re sorry for the confusion this has caused.”
Uh-huh. Suuuuure.
"This language was never intended to be inserted in our policy" - but it was inserted. (I'm obliged to Karl Denninger for downloading and preserving that copy of its proposed new policy version.) What's more, Paypal's a major corporation. It has bushels of lawyers, layers of management, and (presumably) guidelines under which any changes to its policies have to be signed off by multiple levels of control, all the way up to the top. Under those circumstances, you'll pardon me if I find Paypal's weasel words to be less than convincing. "Never intended", indeed! Pull the other one, Paypal - it's got bells on it.
This is yet another example of using corporate power for political, partisan ends. Google's doing it by removing and/or censoring blogs that don't toe the party line. Twitter does it by suspending or canceling user accounts. Facebook blocks people for varying lengths of time for saying the politically incorrect thing. Paypal's just the latest "woke" company to jump on the bandwagon.
It's time we took a stand - all of us who value liberty, freedom of speech, and freedom of expression. If we allow faceless corporate drones to act in lieu of - but in reality as agents of - a government that's not supposed to do things like that, then we effectively acquiesce in the neutering of our constitutional rights.
I'm therefore transferring the small balance in my Paypal account to my bank account, and as soon as that's done, I'll be nuking my Paypal account altogether. I can't trust them to be objective and rational in their decisions, and that's a risk I see no reason to incur when I don't have to. I highly recommend that everyone do the same thing. The risk of doing business with Paypal is simply too great to be borne. That also goes for Venmo, which is owned by Paypal. Because of that, I can't trust it either.
A large number of other users are doing likewise. Karl Denninger sums up why they're doing so:
If you have a PayPal account OR ACCEPT THEIR PAYMENT AS A MERCHANT you are consenting to letting them STEAL $2,500 for anything they deem a "violation" without any due process, evidence or proof.
Note that if you linked a bank account they can and will debit the bank account for this and if you keep your account there you're consenting to that.
. . .
Note that "misinformation" can be anything they so-deem and whatever they determine you are bound by. So can anything they deem "unfit for publication" which has no objective definition whatsoever.
. . .
And, note that there is no requirement that the conduct be in any way linked to their services, which have nothing to do with the movement of money, ever, in this regard. Since PayPal is a money transmitter nothing you can send, post or publish has anything to do with the movement of money, which means they can fine you $2,500 for saying that the jabs are dangerous or that there are only two genders no matter where you say it, on what platform you say it or even if you say it in a non-electronic form entirely.
. . .
Close your accounts and under no circumstances EVER do business with these ******** nor EVER hire ANYONE who works for them EVER AGAIN.
There's more in that vein (much more profanely) at the link.
Looking for an alternative? Try Gab Pay. Gab is a social media service that's consistently been solidly free-speech in orientation, even though that means racists and neo-Nazis have flourished there. Gab's solution to that is simple - rather than play the censor, it relies on its users to be adults, and block anyone whose views offend them. I do that almost every time I'm online there. If I come across an anti-semitic or racist user, I block them on the spot. Fortunately, there are plenty of Gab users who are neither anti-semitic nor racist, and I get on just fine with them. Gab Pay is one of the platform's new initiatives, designed to take the place of Paypal and other such services. So far, it looks pretty good. Check it out for yourself.
There may be other alternatives. If any readers would like to suggest one, please do so in Comments. I caution, however, that if it's part of the Big Tech world, it's more likely than not to have "woke" elements in its user policies, and may therefore not be fully trustworthy. Caveat emptor, and all that sort of thing.
As for Paypal, I can only suggest that its shareholders and directors ponder the saying "Get woke, go broke". After betraying their customers' trust like this, that's a consummation devoutly to be wished, IMHO.
Peter
Hi Peter,
ReplyDeleteWhen you close your PayPal account, be sure to go to your bank and make sure it's unlinked from PayPal as well. Note that some banks will refuse to do this under the idea that "only PayPal is authorized to unlink your account", in which case, you'll need to close the bank account instead and open a new one. PayPal has always reserved the right to take whatever amount they deem appropriate from your bank account (Terms of Service), which is why the push so hard to link to your bank account.
I've read many Slashdot posts where PayPal has taken money from peoples' bank accounts without recourse. The only action the defrauded individual was able to take was as noted above, close the account and refuse to deal with PayPal again.
Setting themselves up as the censor of the internet, with your bank account held hostage as the stick over your head is just the cherry on top.
How many vice-presidents got fired?
ReplyDeleteIf the language was not supposed to be "pushed" to the public then at least two VPs (Legal and Customer Relations) should be fired for gross incompetence.
If none were fired then the walk-back is pure BS.
No, the walk-back was pure BS anyway, regardless if the VPs got fired or if the VPs just hung it around the neck of some 20-something, blue-haired, underling.
ReplyDeleteI've had a PayPal account since '98, I think. I've bought an enormous amount of stuff with it from metal and tools for the shop, to ham radio rigs, to you name it. I also contribute to charities and that's what scares me.
Every year, I give to a few Christian charities and in the woke age, that's ripe for some twit to declare to be hate speech.
Peter - to use Gab Pay, does one need to open a Gab social media account?
@SiGraybeard: I don't think so, but then, I have a Gab account already, so it might be I didn't notice any cookie recognition or anything like that. From what I've read, it seems to be independent of Gab itself.
ReplyDeleteJust finished "inactivating" all of my "scheduled" payments (aka - every single business who received a payment from me, and three subscriptions). But the account is closed and I requested that my data be deleted as well.
ReplyDeleteIt's a start, but until companies realize that even entertaining such language is a problem, we can't stop fighting.
And as a bonus I discovered that one of my annual subscriptions was charging me three times a year. It wasn't a lot, so I didn't really notice until now.
ReplyDeletePayPal does not care what you do.
ReplyDeleteThey'll keep doing what they are doing until the company itself goes bankrupt and disappears.(and maybe, not even then. Those withdrawal agreements are forever.)
The Cabal will keep funding these corporate sharks until the whole House of Cards collapses. "Get Woke, Go Broke" is a nice slogan, but meaningless. Have we seen any of these Sharks show the slightest financial discomfort? Nobody that supports the Cabal will go Broke. They know it, which is why the attacks and policies continue. Those same actions will be disavowed or walked back temporarily when the spotlight is turned on them, only to be re-started or turned back on when the spotlights shifts to another location.
These things will not stop happening. We, the public cannot outspend the Cabal. We are not helpless, but our boycotts and spending shifts accomplish nothing.
I agree that you should stop using these companies, but know in advance, that they don't care, and it won't affect them. It will be a moral victory for you, but it has no practical purpose.
I was a Manager in a corporation but now I am retired. All corporations when they set any instructions for clients or personnel they have these gone over in depth by their Management and Lawyers for too long. PayPal likely spent months working on it before issuing this. I do not use PayPal and have not in the past.
ReplyDeleteWhen I found out about this Saturday, I dumped them. Like SGB, I have purchased a fair amount of stuff using their services over the last 20 plus years. I was immediately interested that they "admitted" to posting misinformation, and I laughed knowing they'd never give $2500 to each of their users for doing so.
ReplyDeleteThank God I never linked my bank account...
Hubby started using E-bay soon after it started and joined paypal when ebay linked with them. Once he died I called to cancel account and retrieve any money left. I had a list that they required to cancel and would never give me any answer for dollars in account. Hubby had not been very active the last 3 years so I knew it wasn't much so I just finally gave up. But never had and never will use that company.
ReplyDeleteRE: Antitrust
ReplyDeleteBeginning from the assumption that incorporation is a concept that two are better than one, yet that body may become so great as to represent a threat to the good of The People.
The government can and does act to reduce the alleged threat; the breakup of 'Ma Bell' being exhibit A. What then would prohibit the government from acting thus against other concepts; namely that of the censoring of thought or action of other persons, individually or collectively?
@ Skwab
ReplyDelete" Nobody that supports the Cabal will go Broke."
It's not about making them go broke.
They have publicly declared that they are going to steal from you, and only a fool would continue to deal with someone who has declared himself to have both the means and the intent to steal from you.
It's about reducing your financial risk.
Don't get so caught up in politics that you forget how to do business without losing your shirt.
Had used PayPal from about 1999 until they suddenly closed my account in late 2019 for supposedly 'violating' their terms of service. After several calls I never did get a straight answer as to what terms I violated. Most likely was some of the purchases I made online for firearms accessories that got me. Screwed up my eBay account and ability to pay for over a year until it finally decided to start working.
ReplyDeleteI've been using CashApp for sending and receiving money from friends (and had bought my current vehicle with it). Not a lot of merchants, if any, are using it yet, so am looking into Gab Pay as another option.
Since Peter is a retired chaplain, and this is a family-friendly blog, I'll just say:
ReplyDeleteLET'S GO PAYPAL IYKWIMAITYD